Chinese Restaurant Torture

I've been told some people actually enjoyed reading my post about Grasshopper.  If you didn't like that, what follows will probably just be Chinese restaurant torture.  Read on if you like for an informal genealogy of some of Durham's Chinese restaurants, and consider this a companion piece to my Grasshopper post. 

When I first came to Durham, the only Chinese restaurants I knew about were the China Inn on Hillsborough Road (now defunct), the still extant Shanghai (farther west near Kroger), and what I believe was called Mandarin House at South Square Mall (restaurant and mall both defunct).  China Inn seemed to be a Duke staple: it was much easier to get to from Duke at the time, as 147 (designated I-85 at the time) didn't go so far northwest, and Trent Drive went all the way from Duke's West Campus to China Inn and Jim's Party Store, right across the street.  China Inn even survived a fire sometime in the mid-80's, in the sense that the building was totally rebuilt from the ground up and the restaurant re-opened. 

Mandarin House was farther away and tougher for me to get to: I believe it moved across 15-501 into a non-South-Square space, then later changed its name, then closed.

Shanghai had an all-you-can-eat buffet on Sunday mornings when I first encountered it back in 1980 or so.  I can remember repeatedly going there and stuffing my face.  I don't know if they still have a buffet, but they still serve really good, straight-up, main-line Chinese-American food, and I'm never embarrassed to take someone there.  For some reason, the place has passed into disfavor among my friends, which I can't understand at all.  I much prefer Shanghai to places like Mount Fuji or Pao Lim.  As for my friends, all I can respond with is de gustibus non est disputandum. 

Around 1985, I started living in Trinity Park -- about one good Frisbee throw from Hunam on Main Street.  (They were in the location that later became Rainbow -- a different restaurant that's cheap and OK, but nothing special.)  Hunam was a good, inexpensive Chinese restaurant at the time.  I was probably there once a week, stretching my budget by ordering the dinner special, eating half of it -- the soup, the eggroll, and some of the entree and rice -- and taking the rest home.  It's true that most Chinese food is best appreciated freshly cooked.  It's also true that poor people will eat about anything.  Further, it seemed to me that leftover spicy Chinese food was a good hangover cure: it seemed you'd either get better or worse, and I never got worse.  Hunam was essentially my local bar at the time.  You can understand that I was in there a lot.

In fact, I was in Hunam so much that I got to know folks.  The proprietor was named, IIRC, Oliver.  I can't remember his wife's name, which pains me, as she was very friendly.  Almost everyone there was unfailingly nice to me.  Maybe that's because one of them thought I "looked like Jesus."  I even started being comped stuff -- usually the occasional Tsingtao.  And I enjoyed the place thoroughly.  Sometime in (IIRC) the 90s, I asked after Oliver, not having seen him for a while. I was told that he'd gone to Hong Kong to sell an advertising business there of his before the mainland Chinese government reasserted control over the island.  Sometime after Oliver got back, he left Hunam and started the first Neo-China. 

Neo-China, IMO, was the best Chinese restaurant in Durham at the time.  One nice thing about the place was the use of fresh, seasonal, local vegetables in traditional Chinese-American restaurant dishes.  The place was also decorated with Oliver's own artwork.  It definitely didn't look like a typical Chinese restaurant.  Neo-China did well enough that it expanded into the space next door.  Later two more locations were opened: one in Raleigh, and another in Cary.  Oliver followed that up by opening a non-Chinese restaurant in the new (at that time) New Hope Commons.  Alas, the new venture, dubbed Neo-Renaissance, didn't last long.  I saw little of Oliver after that.  Sometime around then, Neo-China was (I believe) sold to someone else who I'd seen working there.  Neo-China is still quite good, and still owned, I believe, by the guy who took it over when Oliver left. 

Meanwhile, after Oliver left Hunam, Leo stepped up to be the proprietor.  (Actually, I was never sure who actually owned the place or made the operational decisions.  I'm just making guesses based on what I saw in the place.)  Leo was also very kind, almost to the point of obsequiousness.  I continued getting good food, good service, and even an occasional free Tsingtao, up until Leo left to start his own place.  After Leo left, I didn't keep up with Hunam closely, except to notice that it went downhill, eventually closed, and re-opened as Rainbow. 

Leo's new restaurant was called Chopstix, at K-Mart Plaza (now called Avondale Plaza), near the intersection of Avondale Drive and Roxboro Road.  At the time, I felt maybe Leo had been motivated by Oliver's ventures.  Chopstix was a much more traditional Chinese place than Neo-China, though, and was also less expensive.  I imagine the business got harder after a Chinese buffet opened just up the street; Leo added a small buffet of his own at the time.  I'd started driving by then, and I ate a whole lot of take-out from there.  Leo stayed at Chopstix until a few years ago, when he sold the business to someone else. 

That's about all I can come up with in this bastard genealogy of Durham Chinese restaurants.  But I do have one observation: While most of these restaurants have had their ups and downs, and while some other small (and large) operations have been mediocre to bad, I still prefer taking a chance on any independent Chinese operation over a chain.  At one time, there was no such thing, but now Chinese restaurant chains exist; in my experience, they're always aggressively mediocre.  The risk of eating poorly is the risk one takes in order to eat well.  Eating at a chain dooms one to lowest-common-denominator, un-exciting food.  I urge you all to think about that the next time you go out to any sort of chain restaurant.  If you love the place, great.  But think about trying that funky little non-chain place you've seen -- you might otherwise be missing out. 

Comments

[Lenore]

Frank and Lily Chao opened Mandarin House in South Square mall roughly around 1980. Around 1990, they moved across 15-501 to where the Mayflower is now. I'd say maybe 8 years after that, they sold it and moved to California. After about a year, they moved back to Durham and opened Eastern Lights. They still run it today. As far as I know, Lily's brother still owns China Express, on 54, so there's a lot of similarity in their menus including dishes that were on Mandarin House's original menu.

[Eric J]

Hunam has a special place in my heart- it's the first restaurant I ever ate in in Durham, when I drove down with my Parents to move into my dorm at Duke in January of '88. There was also a dinner eaten there during FrefCon, and was the destination one Christmas day when I did The Stupidest Thing I Have Ever Done.

And I concur on your Neo-China opinion, and remember one trip to Neo-Renaisance. (Did there used to be a Chinese-Italian restaurant called Marco Polo on 15-501?) I'd really like to see more Chinese restaurants use fresh, seasonal vegetables.

You still need to get up here some time to go to Peking Gourmet. I think they've gone downhill a little bit the last year or two, but stick to certain dishes (Peking Duck, Crispy Sezhuan Beef Proper, anything with their specially grown garlic sprouts), and they are possibly the best old-fashioned Chinese restaurant in the US.

[Joe]

Lenore: Thanks. I believe the "Mayflower XIV" seafood restaurant or whatever the hell it is is also closed. It makes sense that Eastern Lights is pretty good, if it's the successor in some sense to Mandarin House.

Eric: I know I've eaten at Hunam on Xmas day, but I don't remember if you were there. I've always thought that one of the great things about the US is Chinese restaurants being open for Xmas. :)

Yes, there really was a Marco Polo. I remember eating there, but don't remember much about it. The main reason the place sticks in my mind is because of the Country Squire, which preceded Marco Polo in that building. The original Country Squire was started in Duplin County. I understand the person (whom I believe is now dead) who opened the first place was in on opening the second, Triangle-located one. I have a dim memory of being told that a couple of local women were in on it too, and that Joseph (yes, I think that was his first name) later pulled out to concentrate on the Duplin County operation. I was amazed to find one in the Triangle, as I'd seen the one in Southeastern N.C. first.

If any of you are ever in the Falls Church, Va. area and get a chance to go to Peking Gourmet, please do. Our DC expert at the time, code-named "Kevan," took us to this little gem in an unprepossessing strip mall in Falls Church. The Peking Duck was a revelation, and changed the way we feel about duck. Kevan is a big fan of what was called at the time "Szechuan Beef Proper." And, BTW, there's none of this "order a day ahead" crap for the duck. A special staff member comes to slice the duck for you at table. The green onions used with the duck are farmed especially for the restaurant. I've managed to make it there twice, with maybe a year or two between visits, and I'll swear that the host recognized me.

[weege]

China Palace on the corner of Garrett & Old Chapel Hill isn't much to look at it (Christmas lights galore!), but the food is incredible. They have typical Chinese-American fare which is quite good, but do yourself a favor and request the Chinese menu (it has English translations). Their very best dishes can be found there. Before I went vegetarian, my favorite Chinese menu dish was the spicy bean curd with shredded pork and hot Asian peppers. It is quite the possibly the best hangover food known to man.

[Joe]

Weege: Thanks -- I'll give the place a try. One of the things I liked about Chopstix was that, for a long time while Leo owned it, they also had a Chinese menu. I didn't like everything on it, but I really liked the fact that they had it. :)

Now that I think about it, I also remember one of the things I really liked about Hunam was a soup they had called, IIRC, chicken and Szechuan cabbage soup. It was just chicken broth with little pieces of chicken and pickled vegetable, but I used to get it almost every time I went in the place.

[Rob]

Joe--

Fantastic post on the history of Chinese restaurants in Durham.

There's one notable omission: Hong Kong, the dim sum place on Guess Road. I remember going there on Sunday with Michael and Eric once for my first exposure to dim sum.

I ate at Marco Polo once with Mo. Get this--it was on Thanksgiving, because it was the only open restaurant! So I had a meal with chinese food, italian food AND turkey.

I still remember you, me and Eric walking to Hunam on xmas day. It was FREEZING, so it felt great to get inside and get food.

I agree with you 100% on Shanghai vs Pao Lim/Mt Fuji. Shanghai does the little things right: really tasty hot 'n sour soup, dumplings that aren't too doughy, decent quality meat in their moo sho, etc. Plus their prices are incredibly reasonable, and the decor is pleasing.

[Joe]

Hong Kong is good, particularly in that they offer Dim Sum, which not too many places around here do. I left them out, along with probably dozens of other places, because I don't know much about them. I mostly concentrated on the places that sprung out of Hunam, with a few exceptions to liven things up. Those were the places I knew best.

[Eric J]

I'm curious - any Korean places in Durham? Annandale has arguably the best Korean restaurant scene outside of Korea (and possibly California) but I almost never eat Korean. I'm a bit intimidated, and it's my experience that Korean restaurants aren't interested in introducing westerners to the cuisine or help them make choices.

[Lenore]

Joe, the Mayflower N is still there and open. I had the misfortune of eating there yesterday.

[weege]

Eric J - the only Korean places that I know of are in RTP near 54 & 55. There's Chosun Ok and Vit Goal. I've been to both and the wait staff were always eager to help me with the menu. An excellent Korean dish to start with would be hot stone pot bibimbap. You really can't go wrong with this dish. Yummy!

[Joe]

Lenore: Clearly, Mayflower XXVIIL was the force in the universe that drove Joe's Crap Crab Shack out of business just up the road. ;) I guess it just looked dead from 15-501.

[Paula]

Eric J - I think there's a Korean place over on Guess south of 85. Or is that Vietnamese? It's been years since I went in, so I honestly can't recall. But hey, it is an Asian food option!

[Joe]

Paula, I think that's Kim Son you're thinking of, which is Vietnamese. See the comments under my Grasshopper post.

[Steve]

It's great to read this, since I've had several discussions with neighbors since moving to Durham about the dearth of good Chinese food. When my wife and I were visiting here about 3 years ago, we were looking for the Crab Shack but with the torrential downpour courtesy of hurricane Charlie we ended up at China Inn. I drove past there recently and I think that it's now something totally contrary to the style of the building - maybe a taqueria? Too funny!

You've listed some places we may need to try. My wife likes the Americanized Chinese food, but I have more, uh, discerning tastes and have yet to find any Chinese food here in Durm that I like. (For me, Shanghai and Pao Lim were big disappointments in food as well as the non-service).

I hate to say it, but the best Chinese food I've had since moving here has been at P.F. Chang's. That's a sad statement. Hopefully the resurgence of downtown will attract a top-notch establishment.

[Maura]

I don't know how authentic it is, as I assume I've never had anything other than Americanized Chinese food, but JP and I swear by Eastern Lights. Authentic or not, it's very good food. (Of course, I'm not as forgiving when it comes to Italian or classic American food, because that's something I know a little bit about.)

[Joe]

Steve: Thanks for stopping by. I've never eaten at a P. F. Chang's, because my experience with Chinese chains is not positive. I should at least try it sometime.

There's a parody of the well known The Way Things Work called The Way Things Really Work by a guy named Henry Beard (of French for Cats fame). There was a joke explanation in the book about something like "How the Food in All Chinese Restaurants Tastes the Same." It explained a system of nationwide pumps, pipes, and valves that delivered the basic product. While it was amusing, I don't think it's correct. :) It'd be nice to know if the food differences that do exist in a class of restaurants are more due to chefs, owners, or what. Knowing that, then you could ask "What would it take to bring an Asian restaurant like, say, The Slanted Door to Durham?

BTW, The Slanted Door rocks. I had one of the best customer service experiences ever in that restaurant, and the food wasn't half bad either. ;)

[Joe]

Maura: That's the way I feel about Indian food: I don't know jack shit about it, and can only say "I like this" or "this isn't good." Which, come to think of it, isn't much more than I say about anything anyway. :)

[Barbara]

I swear by Eastern Lights too. Any restaurant that puts spinach in their wonton soup is on the right track, IMO. Their hunan chicken is fantastic. If only I could find a good Szechuan place here - Red Palace in Raleigh was a huge disappointment the last 2 times.

[Gail]

Oh, yeah--Neo China was always The One. But I, too, began at Shanghai. The only time I ever saw my sister wearing high heels was in the parking lot at Shanghai when I saw her getting out of a car in the parking lot when we ran into her there.

[Joe Eater]

G: Do I need to see your sister in heels? Does it need to be in front of Shanghai, or will any Chinese restaurant do?

[Jack]

I just ran across this on your site, Joe. (At the time it was started I was between places and getting ready to return from Romania, so my inattentiveness, I hope, will be excused!) This is a GREAT thread. I tended to split my meals between Shanghai and Neo-China, though I started as a die-hard Shanghai supporter (only shifting more frequently to Neo-China because Heather (the sig-other) liked it more and because it was a block from where we were living). My heart is still with Shanghai, though. We would get to Shanghai -- usually for take out -- about once a month, but it seemed like every time one of us would go in they would say "Hi Jack! Where's Heather?" or "Hi Heather! Where's Jack?" There was always this really nice feel to the place and I was always really happy with the food. Of course, I am, like many of your commentators, also a big fan of plain old, Americanized Chinese food, so I didn't have the "purist" concern. This is, actually, one of the ironic things about where I'm living in SoCal (behind the Orange Curtain): it's not so easy to find plain old, cheap, bountiful (big portions) Americanized Chinese food. We are regularly directed to these places with "authentic" Chinese food by real-life Asian folks (lots and lots of them here), but I'm never quite as satisfied as I used to be with Shanghai. In fact, one of the LEAST satisfying Chinese food restaurants I've ever gone to has been here -- a repellent place in a really nice spot (right across the street from the Newport Beach bay) called China Palace that has the quadruple curse of being over-priced, small portions, boring taste, and really really tacky interior (faux fancy "tropical"). If only there was a Shanghai here...

[Joe Eater]

Jack: Thanks! I forgive you for being busy. :) The great thing about this post is the boatload of comments I got. I even got plugged in the CoDependent for this one.

[Debra]

China Palace (corner of Garrett & Old Chapel Hill). OMG, you have GOT to be kidding. Went to this place for a carryout meal on the strength of positive reviews here and on other sites. It is Beyond Bad -- so disgusting that, once we got home and tried the food, we hopped back in the car and drove all the way back to demand a refund. The female half of the management eventually provided one after a long argument and a tongue-lashing. (Yeah, we love driving 10 miles there and back just for the fun of it.) The fried potstickers were filled with an unidentifiable pink meat that looked and tasted like a cross between spam and Friskies Classic Pate Veal Dinner and which gave off an aroma of spoiled flesh. The grease from the carton of House Fried Rice leaked out of the cardboard carton, through the bag, and onto my lap. Mercifully, it had no scent whatsoever -- and even less flavor. Wild water buffalo could not drag us back to this hellish hole in the wall and its incompetent cooks. Truly heinous.

[Joe Eater]

Debra - Ugh. I always hate to hear when someone has such a bad episode somewhere, no matter where it is.

[Barbara]

"Great article Joe on Chinese restaurant in Durham. Spring Rolls Restaurant in North Hills, Raleigh opened in May 2010. It is an Asian fusion restaurant specializing in Mandarin, Szechuan, and Thai cuisine.
Spring Rolls is located across the street from Moe’s Southwest Grill, on The Circle at North Hills, in between Rodolfo Gonzales Interior Design and McKenzie Tribe.
I had been to Spring Rolls many times and never been disappointed with its food quality and service."

[Alan]

Would anyone care to chime in, as to the 2015 Chinese Buffet landscape?

[Joe Eater]

Alan, I've spent most of my Chinese restaurant eating time avoiding Chinese buffets. They seemed to me to be the antithesis of what was supposed to be good about Chinese food. But something happened on the way out of the buffet: I started eating at them. And I think that's a bad thing, because every non-buffet Chinese restaurant in the area has gone downhill at the same time. I can't say for sure they're related, but I think they are. I load up on my favorites that I can find, take them home, and eat barely warm and dried-out food.

It's very frustrating to me to get Chinese food these days, because I don't even have a favorite Chinese restaurant any more. I don't really have a favorite buffet either. Some folks I know like to eat at Ichiban Hibachi Supreme Buffet in Avondale Plaza, but it's a chain of sorts, I think, with near-identical restaurants elsewhere.

For non-buffet, I go back and forth between Happy China near Rockwood, and Shanghai on West Hillsborough near the 147/15-501 interchange.

Good luck. If you have any suggestions yourself, please let us know. And I don't mean to sound like a snob here. It's just really disappointing lately, especially given how much other dining in the area has taken off and headed skyward. The one bright spot is Charlie Deal's Juju near 9th and Markham/Hillsborough. That's not a buffet, but it's certainly worth a visit or three. :)